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We're still alive-ish [live/cat and bowel issues update]

Yumi

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Hey all!

wow has it really been since October I've been here?! Holy guacamole then time flew by fast. D:
So in a speedy quick update.
This site has changed so much I feel sooooo lost - I can't even find the post button. Oh dear loooord. Can I have the old one back? lol!
Edit: wait, found it xD not sure if I overlooked it or.. o_o yeah. Didn't had much sleep last night. Think a hour or two. Thanks Safira!
We moved to a bigger place - yay more room for us and more room for the kitten.
It's a whole adjustment from coming half the size to double the size, from 13th stunning view no garden floor to bottom with porch garden but no view floor lol.
(yeah we couldn't have both :p not how it works hehe)
But it's heavy as I'm running behind with my household and have no help and prefer not to ask my better half as he already works so many hours on the road :(
He got a company car to be on the road which is nice, alas it's a un-comfy loud one. They went a little to budget there :|
And I'm seeing a specialist again for myself, hopefully it finally brings some clarity and solutions as it's specialist number 874521.
Toes crossed for that cause it ain't cheap but there is hope and that's all that counts as health has no price tag <3

But in a more important update, I started to struggle with my peanut aka Safira.
You remember her right, that little mischievous looking cutie pie face.
In case you forgot:
when she was a wee kitten:
91402

and nowadays:
91401


Oh yeah she sure did grow and is becoming a lady for sure and I can't even start to tell what a brat she became.
(despite the vet says she's small for her age? :/ - she's a good 3 kilograms though lol)
We try to correct her but you know how they are xD not caring in the world that you tell them no.
But with her being 8 months now, there is hope that she'll calms down when she goes adult.
Not that she fully has to calm down of course, but sometimes a tiiiiiny little less maniac and little more affectionate is welcome LOL.

Alas she's also giving me tons of troubles bowel wise and we're still looking for a solution for about hmm... almost half a year now I guess :(
So far she got tested on a 3 day collection (Gardia, tritri and I think some others too) several times.
She also had a blood test.
Nothing to be found there, just nothing, nada. Which is goooood..? besides the fact it's not helping to pin down the cause.
She got anti worm thingy. She had a special paste for her bowels, special kibbles for digestion, probiotica,...

So the issue is, on kibble when she goes to the litter box, there is slime/mucus in the poop and blood. It smells awful and it's pretty diaree-ish.
And after a few minutes some extra clear slime/mucus/watery substance that smells like fish comes out without her being able to controle it.
So we put her on raw food (little nuggets, compleet pre made) and she still has the slime/mucus in the poop and diaree-ish and the slime running out her butt issue but the blood is at least gone.
So we tried hypoallergenic raw food, but it stays the same as the normal raw food only that it costs more.

I also noticed if she runs around, sometimes she sounds like a water bag. Anyone ever heard that with their cat?
I tried to google this issue but without much luck D:
Also noticed the slime is at the end of her poop, not between or upfront.
I got the question if she pushes hard and to be honest, she's my first cat. I don't know if she pushes normal or to hard :( And I also don't know how to tell.
When is normal normal?
So of course the past few months we've been trying to pinpoint it with me always running after her with a wet whipe, once after the deed and often 5-10 mins later for the excessive mucus/slime that comes out extra.

I know sphynx are know for having less good bowels sometimes and that some may grow out of it once they pass the adult stage (1 year when considered adult?) but there has to be something I can do to help her, food wise, probiotica, cause it's always a whole meow drama when she has to go and it breaks my heart.

important to say:
so far I never caught her having a fever.
Nor did she lose weight or appetite and she still plays - so it's not like she's sick to the edge of death. Far from.
But the poop, wet butt issue stays a big issue.

should we try kibble again maybe despite having tried several recommended brands?
Stay on raw despite even hypoallergenic not making a difference, oddly enough?
I don't even know if the raw we give is good enough. It's so hard to find around where I am and I'm not up to making it myself. :(
Anything besides probiotica or what's it called that you can give for stress or irritated bowel, mucus/slime/stomach related issues?
I ordered something that's called ''Veenliquid'' from luposan. I think it translates too moor?
Something like this (different brand but should be the same thing)

Sanafor at a glance:
  • Supplementary food for dogs, cats and small pets
  • The vital nutrients in Sanafor:
    • Helps with digestive problems
    • Stimulates the growth of intestinal mucus and gut flora
    • Neutralises stomach acid
    • Supports production of new blood cells (high iron content, 400 mg/kg)
    • Can stop your pet from eating faeces and other waste
so hopefully that will help, specially with the mucus and the constancy of the poop.
Not much to lose unless it really gets worse again, which hopefully it wont cause it does have fairly good reviews.

So besides all of the above... I'm so lost in what else we can do so suggestions and idea's are more then welcome!
(not to mention, the vet is even more clueless and talks about cutting her open to take a sample of her bowels etc to check it out. I was like oh hell no o_o so now I dislike my vet and considering despite all the test she ran and all the money we threw against it, to get a second opinion somewhere else)

Thanks in advance for catching up with us :)
Lots of love,
Yumi and Safira.
 
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Sheldon13

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Phew!

Usually when the bowel (or any part of the body) secretes excess mucous it means there is an irritant in there it is trying to protect itself from. Have you considered a food allergy?


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Yumi

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Phew!

Usually when the bowel (or any part of the body) secretes excess mucous it means there is an irritant in there it is trying to protect itself from. Have you considered a food allergy?


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We haven hence why we tried hypoallergenic raw food for over two months.
With horse cause it's being said chicken and beef can be two big allergy points.
But we're open to try anything else if you have a suggestion. Kibble or raw if we can find it here.
<3
 

Wombat1017

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What raw foods are you using? The less ingredients are usually better and try fish I know maybe it seems like a bad idea because her stool already smells like that but it’s worth a shot. My cat had mucus diarrhea exactly like how you describe when we gave her instinct rabbit formula and then we just switched back to her raw patties and she was fine after but that’s just my experience


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Yumi

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What raw foods are you using? The less ingredients are usually better and try fish I know maybe it seems like a bad idea because her stool already smells like that but it’s worth a shot. My cat had mucus diarrhea exactly like how you describe when we gave her instinct rabbit formula and then we just switched back to her raw patties and she was fine after but that’s just my experience


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We where using this one:

but now are going back to this one:

oddly enough on recommendation of the vet.
She says there fairly good but as a absolute noob I kinda don't know for sure on either of them. :S

The horse none hypo diet is what caused for the blood to stop and makes her go once/day instead of 3-4 times.
The mucus is still here though. I personally don't notice much difference between hypo and horse in the litter box.

I know there are other brands of raw out here but a bit harder to find unless you buy them in really huge amounts, which we don't have freezer space for so yeah :/

So you gave her rabbit? I'm not English or known well with raw so a bit at loss what you mean with instinct rabbit and if that's raw or kibble :)
As for the fish, really scared she'll indeed get worse with it and isn't compleet enough but we may try it if the powder we ordered isn't helping. (Moos or something, for stomach and bowels)
 

Wombat1017

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We where using this one:

but now are going back to this one:

oddly enough on recommendation of the vet.
She says there fairly good but as a absolute noob I kinda don't know for sure on either of them. :S

The horse none hypo diet is what caused for the blood to stop and makes her go once/day instead of 3-4 times.
The mucus is still here though. I personally don't notice much difference between hypo and horse in the litter box.

I know there are other brands of raw out here but a bit harder to find unless you buy them in really huge amounts, which we don't have freezer space for so yeah :/

So you gave her rabbit? I'm not English or known well with raw so a bit at loss what you mean with instinct rabbit and if that's raw or kibble :)
As for the fish, really scared she'll indeed get worse with it and isn't compleet enough but we may try it if the powder we ordered isn't helping. (Moos or something, for stomach and bowels)
They seem pretty good! I’m sorry I should have explained it better but it’s a kibble that’s coated in raw stuff (I’m not entirely sure how it works) the brand is called instinct but I think it’s only American. Yeah I agree it might make it worse too, I’m not sure if you already said but have u tried cooking a very bland meal for her ? Like rice and cod or something similar?


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Yoda mom

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@Yumi ! Welcome back! Safira is gorgeous!
Your new home sounds wonderful! lol my 8 year old girl is the zoomiest fast too

Did your vet do a PCR test ?

Discuss possible false negative test for tritrichomonas? Giardia or crypto?
Some vets may treat for even if negative test ?
I ask because tri tri is often mucous blood still as you described

Some vets will still treat for giardia
Was she ever prescribed Flagyl , metronidazole or ronidazole?
**fyi ronidazole can have neurotoxicity reactions
So alway discii with your vet side effects of any medications prescribed

Just wanted to share especially if you are seeking a Second opinion .
You can ask the vet office for a copy of her records and take to the second opinion

All paws crossed for Safira!

Following closely for updates!
Head smooches sent
 
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Yumi

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They seem pretty good! I’m sorry I should have explained it better but it’s a kibble that’s coated in raw stuff (I’m not entirely sure how it works) the brand is called instinct but I think it’s only American. Yeah I agree it might make it worse too, I’m not sure if you already said but have u tried cooking a very bland meal for her ? Like rice and cod or something similar?


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Yes, we've tried very bland food as well. Prescription hills, but on that she kinda went bezert in a way of eating like her live depended on it. I think there was not enough things in there for her to get satisfaction and her litter box issue didn't clear up either.
And no, cause we have not tried to cook our own bland meal for her yet besides some rice and rice water to help clear up diarea when it got really bad when she still was on kibble.

Never heard of such kibble before, so maybe we don't have them around here? :S



@Yumi ! Welcome back! Safira is gorgeous!
Your new home sounds wonderful! lol my 8 year old girl is the zoomiest fast too

Did your vet do a PCR test ?

Discuss possible false negative test for tritrichomonas? Giardia or crypto?
Some vets may treat for even if negative test ?
I ask because tri tri is often mucous blood still as you described

Some vets will still treat for giardia
Was she ever prescribed Flagyl , metronidazole or ronidazole?
**fyi ronidazole can have neurotoxicity reactions
So alway discii with your vet side effects of any medications prescribed

Just wanted to share especially if you are seeking a Second opinion .
You can ask the vet office for a copy of her records and take to the second opinion

All paws crossed for Safira!

Following closely for updates!
Head smooches sent
PCR test? English not so good, so not sure what that is blush forgive me.

I did not discuss the possible false positive, although she's been tested once by the breeder and 3 times by my vet and she did got medication twice preventive for Gardia and TriTri. Don't recall how it was called though D: They really should give such meds easier names!
Of course it speaks to itself I also cleaned out her litter box, and still do, very well with anti disinfectant thingy. (Detol)

Good idea about asking a copy of all the records, tests and results done till now!
Thanks! And tysm for the paw crossing <3 hope now everything on the -we moved- base settled a bit down that I can keep better touch again with my lair family <3 ya guys didn't think I forgot about ya, right?. lolol ((hughughughug))
 

Yoda mom

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From my understanding the PCR tests is more accurate
You can ask your vet or the second opinion vet if this test would be indicated

“The best way to diagnose infectious causes of kitten diarrhea is by a test called a fecal PCR test. This very sensitive test detects minute amounts of DNA from these organisms. Have your vet run this test and prescribe specific treatment based on the test results.”

Here is a link


Ps
Your English Is purrfect!
Sphynx language is universal with all of us from all over the world!
 

Yumi

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From my understanding the PCR tests is more accurate
You can ask your vet or the second opinion vet if this test would be indicated

“The best way to diagnose infectious causes of kitten diarrhea is by a test called a fecal PCR test. This very sensitive test detects minute amounts of DNA from these organisms. Have your vet run this test and prescribe specific treatment based on the test results.”

Here is a link


Ps
Your English Is purrfect!
Sphynx language is universal with all of us from all over the world!
well also tried to look into it in Dutch and I'm honestly not sure if that is all done or if it was an other test, so I guess I'll have to stalk that vet again.
I still.. don't like her D: doubt I'll ever will tbh despite she trying to help.
 

Toa and Ross

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Hi there, good to see you’re back. What a changes in you life! Do you feel at home in your new home? Hope the new specialist can help you.
Safira became a very beautiful lady. And she’s so adorable!
The muscus andthe horrible smell could be a sign that somethingis irritating her tummy. How long did you stick with the same food? My boy had diarrhea and tummy issues the first few months. All was tested, nothing was food. I changed foods lots of times and nothing helped. When going on raw it became a little better but not much. Then I decided to stick with the raw for at least 6 months. After a few months his tummy calmed down and his poops went normal.
So maybe go to the raw you used to give and see what happens when you stick to that?

I’m from the Netherlands and as far as I know the test here (and in Belgium) are not called PCR tests. My vet used the term ‘quick’ test and poop and blood test sent to a lab in Germany. Maybe you can ask the vet to sent poop and blood to a lab for further examination?
 

Yumi

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Hi there, good to see you’re back. What a changes in you life! Do you feel at home in your new home? Hope the new specialist can help you.
Safira became a very beautiful lady. And she’s so adorable!
The muscus andthe horrible smell could be a sign that somethingis irritating her tummy. How long did you stick with the same food? My boy had diarrhea and tummy issues the first few months. All was tested, nothing was food. I changed foods lots of times and nothing helped. When going on raw it became a little better but not much. Then I decided to stick with the raw for at least 6 months. After a few months his tummy calmed down and his poops went normal.
So maybe go to the raw you used to give and see what happens when you stick to that?

I’m from the Netherlands and as far the test here (and in Belgium) are not called PCR tests. My vet used the term ‘quick’ test and poop and blood test sent to a lab in Germany. Maybe you can ask the vet to sent poop and blood to a lab for further examination?
It's odd to have a new home but nice - heh not sure how to explain xD
So sorry your boy went through it too, all cleared up now?

Oh thats why it was so hard to find info back about PCR in dutch? :3
Thanks for the info!
And well euh mostly weeks (3-4) on kibble on vet advice although she's was on hypo for a 40-ish days now.
It only took my arm, leg, first born and soul to convince the vet for raw D:
Going back to normal horse and stick to it, we also ordered something called veen liquid (tried to translate it in the main post) cause it had good review and we hope it will boost her a bit too as it has fairly good reviews.
Although - not going to lie- kibble would be easier sometimes, I think raw may just be better for her.

Edit completly overlooked the last part of the message d'oh.
I know poop and bloed went to a lab but think it was a Belgium somewhere here in Antwerp lab lab cause of the bill details.
I'm not sure how to ask her to send it too a specifiek lab as she's kinda.. stuborn and very sensitive for dr google and forums cause she studied years and knows better then all the experience of sphynx owners combined sticks thumb up with a crooked smile
Have I already mentioned I really don't like her :p
 

Yumi

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Update; the liquid moor arrived today, it looks so nasty lol.
I managed to get her to eat it when I mixed it under her food and put a extra treat with it so of course on the first day it will probably not have much effect yet but I'll keep a log when and if I see change ^_^
 

Yumi

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All paws crossed the liquid will help!
So far it seems the liquid helped from the first time using o_O
No poop butt or excessive slime after a minute or 5-10
Paws and toes crossed it stays well cause it is hard to tell on a few days weather it is really solved or if it's temporary spoop break. Time will tell eh :3
 

StacyD

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I suffered from IBS many years ago. Bad cramping, diarrhea, mucus in stool. If it is IBS, for me anyway, I could tell it was the food because I felt bad within an hour of eating. Hope your solution continues to work!
 

Yoda mom

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All paws crossed !
following for updates !

Hugs Head mooches sent
 

Yumi

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I suffered from IBS many years ago. Bad cramping, diarrhea, mucus in stool. If it is IBS, for me anyway, I could tell it was the food because I felt bad within an hour of eating. Hope your solution continues to work!
Oh I have it too but this post isn't about me but the kitten hehe :) I manage fine. She on the other hand, the poor thing. D:


@Yoda mom @Toa and Ross
It seems the moor liquid helped a day or 4 and then the brown butt returned a bit, specially the clear mucus was bad.
The brown itself though feels like play-dough so not to hard - not to soft. So I keep wondering where the irritation keeps coming from, assuming the mucus is due irritation?

We gonne take her off raw food and give kibble one more try.
It's one with 70% fish and no grains or stuff. Hmm hope it's ok to post the link here for people to look into the ingredients (not for promotion purposes or whats so ever, if it's not allowed you can delete it and whoop my bumbum for it ^_^ )
REAL NATURE WILDERNESS FRESH WATER ADULT - Name Ihrer Website

I did noticed with the moor liquid, she has less eye boogers, or she gotten better in taking them out and hiding them in places she shouldn't :/ that's an option too D:

So for the kibble, should I do it in one go, or slowly transit? (edit this is kinda urgent cause well she need food tomorrow o_o)
I know from kibble to raw it was allowed to just do it in one go but from raw to kibble I'm not sure D:

And on another note. She went into heat. If anyone has tips for that, it's welcome too.
I tried acupuncture (oh yes that's a thing apperently) to relief her a bit and it seems to help for a hour or two but I still feel bad she's moaning and crying out for a male.
Edit: tried to google but a lot of sites say different stuff. Do we have a topic on how a cat in heat is/works?
How many days it can be or how often and options?
Maybe we could add the acupuncture to the list. Remind me to look into it tomorrow. I'm gonne try to calm her down again and try to sleep some more as it's almost 4 AM - so hope my post makes a little sense. Sorry if it doesn't. So tired for the nightly and daily howls and little sleep

OMG very impotant edit, the acupuncture I'm talking about does NOT involve needles. I repeat does NOT involve needle. Just a pressure point!!!
 
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Yumi

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Quick note before I go die in bed - I mean sleep o_o sleep. God I'm so tired.
So normally Safira being around a good 3 kilograms she gets 300 grams of raw.
I found a vet site that said to slowly transit back to kibble. I only don't know if I calculated right so lets pray I did.
So for kibble she can have 75 grams a day till she's adult, then it's 40 according to this brand I mentioned in the previous post.
Of course I know you always eyeball a bit if they gain to much or don't have enough but let's go from that estimate.
So I got the following plan based on the following numbers:
300 gram raw food - 75 kibble for her current age and weight.

The first 3 days:
1/4 soaked kibble (18-19 gram) + 3/4 raw food (225 gram)
The next 3 days, thus day 4-5-6:
1/2 soaked kibble (37-38 gram) + 1/2 raw food (150 gram)
then the last 3 days being 7-8-9:
3/4 soaked kibble (56-57 gram) + 1/4 raw food (75 gram)
Then from day 10 just kibble - non soaked.

The site states to soak to get the bowels slowly used to the kibble for a easier transition. So toes and paws crossed they are right.
Source: Hoe kan ik het beste overschakelen van v - SANIMED
Toa and Ross can read that language *wink wink*

Any advice is still welcome, will most def check here before I give it to her cause I know combining kibble and raw is NOT recommended because of a different digestion rate.
But giving her bowels the shock of their live going from raw to full kibble is probably not good either.. :(
Though choice! So hopefully that vet site is well more correct and right then I am
 

Yoda mom

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@Yumi Hugs and thoughts for sleep for you!
Tagging @Condo commando @Xandria for raw food info

( Also Not to alarm but to be aware of female kitties that come in heat often without breeding are at risk for pyometra -Uterus infection )

I had a my first female sphynx spayed asap after that first howling experience
(((Hugs to you and head smooches )
 

Condo commando

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It seems like something with the food because all the tests came back negative.

Sometimes a certain kind of food will cause inflammation inside the body. This is important to remember because even if you take that food away, since the damage is already there anything else you feed will appear to be a problem, but it may not be. If that happens, until the cat's body has a chance to heal you won't see a difference just from changing the food.

You say this cat is only 6 months old and you've tried a whole lot of different things, so I'm not sure if she's been on just ONE thing long enough to really know if that thing works on a HEALTHY gastrointestinal tract.

I feed my cats raw food. I adopted a 5 year old sphynx recently that had poo issues and I successfully transitioned him to raw. First his poo got firmer but it was still stinky, but after a few weeks the stink went away. It just takes time sometimes.
 
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Condo commando

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Generally you don't want to give too much fish. I feed my cats a little bit of herring or sardines for omega 3's but it's only about 7% of their diet. Here are reasons why you don't want to overfeed fish (from catnutrition.org):
  • high allergy potential (manifested as skin allergies or inflammatory bowel disease, and possibly asthma)
  • toxin/mercury contamination
  • PBDEs (fire retardant chemicals) – PBDEs are potent thyroid disruptors
  • often high in phosphorus and magnesium
  • highly addictive – the cat will not eat anything else
You also need to be careful with kibble; it has a higher potential than people realize for becoming contaminated. For ex if it sits in a damp environment (who knows how it's been stored) it will eventually grow mold, bacteria, etc.
 

Yumi

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@Condo commando She is 8 months now.
She was indeed on kibble at first but then there was blood and mucus, and after trying some food - special food from the vet like hills i/d - we put her on raw cause I read good stuff about it. But it's rather hard to find here in small batches if you don't have a big freezer to order for hundred and hundred's of euro's. And the brand (jolipet) we have now sometimes doesn't have the horse in stock and I'm scared to give her chicken or beef due allergic risks.
So she's been on raw for hmm 3 months or longer even, didn't keep count D:
She was on horse raw first.
Later on hypoallergenic raw - her poop is a tiny bit firmer but still liquid-y and mucus just runs out of her like crazy and she often has a very brown liquid butt.
One time she even was covered in bright red blood. We had a huge scare there, went to the vet right away but couldn't find anything.
Our -now ex vet- doesn't want to order hypoallergenic anymore - she never told us why and you can't get it if it's not ordered by a vet- she rather wants do a echo and cut her open. Her being only 8 months.. I'm not gone let my baby get cut open by a 25 year old fresh out of school vet o_o hence why she's now our ex vet.

The fish she gets is in the kibble - fish flavor, thought that had the least chance for allergic reaction so we're not sure if it'll get worse or better again.
We're a bit lost on what to do mainly cause most vets don't know either cause they didn't find anything in the blood or in the poop sample we had to collect for 3 days and bring it in (we did this up too 3 times even just to rule out false negatives)

But we had to give kibble towards our feeling another chance cause of the lack of freezer space and finding raw here and most vets just don't wanne order that hypoallergenic. Very frustrating how they're against raw.
-Do have to admit between horse and hypo I didn't see that much difference, the blood was gone at least but the mucus always stayed.
If it gets worse again we're going to see another vet, we're trying to find one that actually knows a bit from sphynx.
Cause I got the feeling the most I find around here treat my baby like any other furry cat and don't know much about specials and genetics and how they can have a bit more complicated bowel issues.

Another thing I've always noticed is that sometimes there's a bit of white around her brown, almost like fat, white fat but I'm not sure if that is it, for all I know it's dried up mucus.

All advice is more then welcome and very appreciated!

Edit; the moor liquid seems to help a little too (supplement) but I'm not sure yet how it'll go with kibble - so it'll be the waiting game again I fear.

@Yoda mom that's why she's still open but I do have to admit if I don't find the cause or can't solve the bowel issue, we're going to have to fix her cause I don't wanne risk it that she passes it on onto her kittens.
 

Condo commando

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@Yumi thanks for explaining all that. I definitely wouldn't let the vet cut up my cat either. Sheesh. This isn't biology class.

I sympathize about raw diets. Vets here aren't keen on raw food either, but due to a recent move I had to find a new vet and I was happily surprised that he was OK with raw food. Mind you he sells the usual vet diets but he didn't say a single negative thing about me feeding raw.

So then since I feed raw, it's not a surprise that if it were me, I would go with raw food over kibble. Only thing is I would stick to poultry or rabbit, not horse. To be honest I don't know anything about horse meat, but I can't see a cat chasing after a horse to eat it. I can see them chasing after birds or rabbits. I googled Jolipet and they have a turkey diet which is what I would start with.

If I understand correctly, you haven't tried to feed any chicken because of reported issues with cats that are fed chicken, right? I know some cats have an issue with it, but let me just say the majority don't. Also, sometimes the issue isn't the chicken but the other stuff that's added in with it. The only way you know is if you try it, and then you can see if it works for your cat or not.

I think it's worth mentioning a bland diet. If a cat has inflammation, a bland diet for a few days helps to relieve the inflammation. I mean even the Jolipet food has other stuff added to it - potatoes, apples, vegetable oils ....it's hard enough to find what's causing the problem without having 10 different things in the food.

My bland, single-ingredient diet of choice is .....chicken. I buy a whole chicken at the grocery store and simmer it for 4-6 hours so all the meat falls off the bones. Add nothing else except a little bit of vinegar to the water; vinegar leaches the minerals from the bones. When it's done I pick out all the bones because cooked bones are a choking hazard. You can offer as chicken soup or just the meat; my cats don't go for the liquid much but they do eat the meat. This is NOT a balanced diet, so you can only give it for a few days. I usually go 2-3 days and freeze the rest (in ice cube trays so I can take out a little at a time). After a few days on the bland food, you can transition to regular food.

If you hate the idea of chicken, maybe you can try to do the same thing with a rabbit. Even with a rabbit carcass (sometimes a butcher has) there is still meat on the bones.

I hope this makes sense but please let me know if I can explain something better. I'm not an expert but I've been raw feeding for 6 years (gasp) and I'm happy to share what I've learned along the way.
 
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