Anyone familiar with FIP? Could use your expertise please :(

[CeleryStalker]

Thank you. Praying she's going to be ok <3

 

[GoldHazel]

Thank you for the warm welcome. My sweet baby's name is Lady Apollonia. She is a seal point and mink, and the most precious little thing I've ever had the opportunity to love. She's amazing. I'll give her some kisses for you. Here's my little munchkin. She was just 2.5# when I brought her home, and already up to 3.7# as of last week. She eats like a little piggy!

She's adorable, @CeleryStalker. My Liam is a seal point mink too. Does Lady Apollonia have white on her face (like markings of a tuxedo)? If she does, that's not a seal point mink. Whatever color she is, she is adorable...that's for sure.

 

[GoldHazel]

So with my Lady, she's DEFINITELY gaining weight, no other symptoms other than the sneezing and redness of her eyes which has been determined to be uveitis and not conjunctivitis. No swollen belly, no poopy issues, not drinking lots and lots. I have her on a raw diet, the one you can get at the website catinfo which was created by a vet a couple decades ago. I've been feeding it since I got a brother/sister duo of maine coons a couple years ago. She LOVES it, and has a very, very healthy appetite. I almost feel like she over eats, but I've always read that you should let a kitten eat as much as they want. I present her with 2-3 oz of this raw diet several times a day, and she always cleans the plate. Piggy!

As far as lysine, I *was* giving those treats. As soon as the word FIP was mentioned, I stopped with the lysine because apparently that can make things worse in a FIP kitty.

The litter we were using before I switched (and currently using after I got rid of that corncob crap) is Arm & Hammer Clump and Seal. I'll check out the list and see about switching if mine isn't on there.

The eye ointment definitely wasn't helping matters, but the vet said that's because the infection is internal not external, so the antibiotics wouldn't have helped anyways. I'm not so sure it was the ointment making things worse, as it started in only one eye, I was only treating the one eye, and then it moved to the other eye as well. She's on steroidal drops now and I'm happy to report they are really doing a great job clearing things up!

Thanks for the links. Your contributions are very appreciated!

@CeleryStalker yes, the L-Lysine isn't a good idea if the dx is FIP as we now know that. But if the dx isn't FIP, please get her on the L-Lysine right away as that will help her sneezing problem. The eye drops you are using should never be used if there is an ulceration in the eye, which is certainly not the case with Lady. My ophthalmologist (veterinarian) told me that the cortisone eye drops can make the eye worse if it's herpes, yet Lady's sneezing tells me that she may very well have herpes, yet her red eyes have been clearing up beautifully. All this makes me really wonder about her breaking blood vessels in her eyes from all her sneezing that caused her gorgeous blue eyes to turn red.

Lady isn't showing any symptoms of wet or dry FIP. Of course, I don't know what the remainder of the blood tests will show. But do NOT panic if the corona virus comes back positive. That does NOT mean FIP, please know that for your sanity.

I'm continuing to pray for Lady.

 

[GoldHazel]

I'm glad your boy didn't end up having FIP. Why did the vet think he did? I'm still holding out hope that her weird blood chemistry can be caused by something else. I mean, it HAS to be possible, otherwise they'd be able to definitively be able to diagnose based on blood chem values alone, ya know?

She's had no other symptoms. Something I cling to as a ray of hope. Then my vet squashes that hope by telling me that cats will act normal until they don't. Ugh. The steroid drops are helping her eyes, and I've stopped giving lysine just in case, because it's not good for FIP kitties. I don't want to exacerbate anything. She is on a grain free raw diet, which is why initially I thought the symptoms were from the damn corn cob litter. I kicked myself, thinking, i don't let her EAT this, why do I let her rummage around in it and then lick all that dust off of herself? Grr.

Thanks so much for sharing your story. I'm remaining cautiously hopeful.

@CeleryStalker there is only one definite way of diagnosing FIP (no matter what blood tests are performed and MRI's, etc.) and that would be to do an autopsy!

 

[GoldHazel]

@GoldHazel No word on the coronavirus titers yet, but the FIV and FELV came back negative. Holding out hope for my baby!

Glad to hear that so far. Good news.

 

[GoldHazel]

I was just told, and shown proof via screen shot of a conversation, that the whole litter was sick with some sort of stomach virus two weeks before I drove down to pick her up. I'm not really happy about this. This was never discussed with my prior to purchase.

@CeleryStalker no, that isn't what you want to hear. I'm not sure who told you that or showed you proof via the screen shot conversation, but again, EVEN if the corona virus is present, it doesn't mean FIP now or ever.

 

[CeleryStalker]

She's adorable, @CeleryStalker. My Liam is a seal point mink too. Does Lady Apollonia have white on her face (like markings of a tuxedo)? If she does, that's not a seal point mink. Whatever color she is, she is adorable...that's for sure.

I'm so used to saying sealpoint because I have had siamese kitties that were, lol She's a seal and mink with white. Derp. I still don't understand the 'mink' part, but I can see her colors are developing. She's a neat looking little thing!

 

[CeleryStalker]

@CeleryStalker no, that isn't what you want to hear. I'm not sure who told you that or showed you proof via the screen shot conversation, but again, EVEN if the corona virus is present, it doesn't mean FIP now or ever.

So my question will be....if she comes back with coronavirus antibodies, and her blood work looks like she's got FIP, how would I know that she doesn't? I'd hate to start her on a lifetime of PI treatments (very expensive trial medication that has shown a lot of good things in the last decade for dry FIP babies) if that's not what's going on. Will the PCR help to rule FIP in or out (by finding something else that might be going on)? That dang bloodwork is what's got me. If she just burst some vessels from sneezing a bunch, I don't know that her bloodwork would be all messed up like it is.

Speaking of sneezing...I've only heard her sneeze twice today. She usually sneezes more than that each hour!

 

[Yoda mom]

Love her name! Good news on less sneezing - all paws crossed for good news - and good health for your kitties

Others can probably chime in details about the PCR test workings
To be honest , I would be upset too with the not forthcomings -
Many of us have walked those shoes - and for me , I decided to not spoil one more day with my baby and moved on
- they know we don't return kitties - the right thing would be a refund and pay for the vet bills and for your babies testing since she is testing her cats -

All I know she is adorable and in the best of love and care with you
Head kisses !
Please keep us updated

 

[Hairless Blessing]

@CeleryStalker
I'm sure you have the answers, you had ask me. I really do pray
your baby will be ok. But, if something does happen, you should
be reimbursed for the Vet fee's plus another kitten. Although,
If she will give you your money back for the kitten, would be better.
You could buy from another breeder.
I hope she will have her's tested and then, you can get a healthy
one and not have to go through this again. Good that's she's in
contact with you daily, hope she will do you right.

 

[GoldHazel]

I'm so used to saying sealpoint because I have had siamese kitties that were, lol She's a seal and mink with white. Derp. I still don't understand the 'mink' part, but I can see her colors are developing. She's a neat looking little thing!

Yes, Lady is a neat looking thing. LOL

Here is a link about sphynx color:
What color is my Sphynx? Seal Mink Sphynx

 

[GoldHazel]

So my question will be....if she comes back with coronavirus antibodies, and her blood work looks like she's got FIP, how would I know that she doesn't? I'd hate to start her on a lifetime of PI treatments (very expensive trial medication that has shown a lot of good things in the last decade for dry FIP babies) if that's not what's going on. Will the PCR help to rule FIP in or out (by finding something else that might be going on)? That dang bloodwork is what's got me. If she just burst some vessels from sneezing a bunch, I don't know that her bloodwork would be all messed up like it is.

Speaking of sneezing...I've only heard her sneeze twice today. She usually sneezes more than that each hour!

All I know about the PI is that it's started early on in FIP, not just a positive corona virus test. And only for dry FIP.

 

[GoldHazel]

@CeleryStalker
I'm sure you have the answers, you had ask me. I really do pray
your baby will be ok. But, if something does happen, you should
be reimbursed for the Vet fee's plus another kitten. Although,
If she will give you your money back for the kitten, would be better.
You could buy from another breeder.
I hope she will have her's tested and then, you can get a healthy
one and not have to go through this again. Good that's she's in
contact with you daily, hope she will do you right.

@CeleryStalker if the corona virus is in your breeder's cattery, it will "be there"! All of her cats will test positive for it.

 

[Hairless Blessing]

@CeleryStalker if the corona virus is in your breeder's cattery, it will "be there"! All of her cats will test positive for it.

I agree!!!

 

[Toa and Ross]

Thank you for the warm welcome. My sweet baby's name is Lady Apollonia. She is a seal point and mink, and the most precious little thing I've ever had the opportunity to love. She's amazing. I'll give her some kisses for you. Here's my little munchkin. She was just 2.5# when I brought her home, and already up to 3.7# as of last week. She eats like a little piggy!

She's so beautiful and adorable!

 

[Toa and Ross]

I was just told, and shown proof via screen shot of a conversation, that the whole litter was sick with some sort of stomach virus two weeks before I drove down to pick her up. I'm not really happy about this. This was never discussed with my prior to purchase.

Sorry to hear you just find out about this issue. Do you know which kind of stomach virus it was? Maybe that can help to pinpoint what the issue is now.

And try to let it go about the breeder not informing you. I can imagine you're angry but it's better to let go!

 

[Toa and Ross]

So my question will be....if she comes back with coronavirus antibodies, and her blood work looks like she's got FIP, how would I know that she doesn't? I'd hate to start her on a lifetime of PI treatments (very expensive trial medication that has shown a lot of good things in the last decade for dry FIP babies) if that's not what's going on. Will the PCR help to rule FIP in or out (by finding something else that might be going on)? That dang bloodwork is what's got me. If she just burst some vessels from sneezing a bunch, I don't know that her bloodwork would be all messed up like it is.

Speaking of sneezing...I've only heard her sneeze twice today. She usually sneezes more than that each hour!

Hurray for less sneezing!!!

 

[GoldHazel]

@CeleryStalker, any news?

 

[Ty Flea]

I don't think you need to be to worried about FIP. The symtoms of FIP are severe and you would be fighting a battle keeping her alive right now. FIP is not 100% fatal, there has been some resent cases of recovery using Theraflu and blood transfusions but it takes extreme action and a good bit of money and hope. The fact that the 'infection' traveled from one eye to another suggests a bacterial element but isn't always the case. Her baseline doesn't look that off but her potassium levels are a little high and her sodium is alittle low. What are you feeding her? The fact that her eye's cleared up with steroidal drops is very telling. Steroids repress the immune system so that means that the symptoms are directly correlated with her immune systems response or to an inappropriate autoimmune system response. Did they mention if her lymphoids or spleen are enlarged?

 

[CeleryStalker]

@GoldHazel Nothing official yet. Looks like the coronavirus titers might have come back in but the doctor who can access the online records was out of the office today.

@Ty Flea Your post gave me goosebumps and made me cry happy tears, so thank you! What you've said aligns so perfectly with some research I was doing today. On the FIP Fighters page on FB, someone suggested other illnesses that would mimic her bloodwork results, and one of the things she mentioned was pneumonia. So here's the thing- remember I switched kitty litter to a corn cob based litter right around the same time her symptoms started? Well, being the Google junky that I am, I looked into the litter being the culprit to her eye and sneezing, and read allll about how corncob can harbor fungal growth.

As I was reading about the different kinds of pneumonia, I saw it comes in different varieties. Fungal, Bacterial, and Aspiration. As I read through the symptoms, they seem to align more closely to what was going on with her, albeit not in the 'worst case scenerio' situations they go on to describe. But both vets commented on her erratic breathing, something we've chalked up to her being nervous at the vet. She doesn't usually have a fast breathing rate or heart rate at home, but at the vet, look out! I do notice, every so often at home however, that she seems to breath a little more deeply, quickly than other times, even if she wasn't just tearing around the house like a crazy woman.

As far as diet....she was eating Orijen Six Fish kibble, but only because the raw diet I was previously feeding my maine coons was put on hiatus for a while, while we worked out whether or not those little turds (brother/sister duo) were having adverse reactions to chicken as suggested by our vet. The raw diet is from a website I can't mention here due to the limited number of posts I've made and the apparent forum rules that don't allow for linking for new members (smart, i hate spammers!). It's a vet created recipe, and consists of chicken thighs with bone and skin, chicken liver, egg, water, vit b, vit e, taurine, lite salt, fish oil, and water. I throw it all through my meat grinder and serve raw. She's been on this raw diet since this past Saturday, and let me tell ya, she eats like a CHAMP. Lady loves her some raw!

Her eyes continue to look better, but I can definitely tell they are relying on those drops. They clear up nicely shortly after I apply in the morning, but by her night time application, they've started to become red again. I'll take the temporary relief over nothing, and I realize it can take some time to clear up whatever might be going on in there. She's only been on the drops twice daily since last Friday.

The doctor has NOT mentioned anything about lymphoids or spleen, but truth be told, once that opthamologist said OH NO'S, FIP, that's pretty much the only thing she's focused on. Our history with this doctor is literally two visits- once on Thursday for exam and blood draw, once on Friday to test pressure of eyes before prescribing steroidal drops. We discussed the preliminary results from her blood chemistry on Friday, and I've been a flippin' wreck every since. I spoke with her on the phone Monday and learned the FIV and FeLV were negative, but we're still waiting on titers. Even if this vet continues to pursue the FIP route, I intend to take her not only back to my original vet for re-assessment, but to a cats-only veterinary hospital in hopes that they might be more in tune with cat illness, especially in the Sphynx.


So....whatcha think?

 

[GoldHazel]

I don't think you need to be to worried about FIP. The symtoms of FIP are severe and you would be fighting a battle keeping her alive right now. FIP is not 100% fatal, there has been some resent cases of recovery using Theraflu and blood transfusions but it takes extreme action and a good bit of money and hope. The fact that the 'infection' traveled from one eye to another suggests a bacterial element but isn't always the case. Her baseline doesn't look that off but her potassium levels are a little high and her sodium is alittle low. What are you feeding her? The fact that her eye's cleared up with steroidal drops is very telling. Steroids repress the immune system so that means that the symptoms are directly correlated with her immune systems response or to an inappropriate autoimmune system response. Did they mention if her lymphoids or spleen are enlarged?

@Ty Flea where is this hopeful information documented? I've researched FIP for a long time and the only thing that I know about dry FIP is that if the cat is started on PI very early on in the dx, it can keep a cat alive and doing well for longer than if no PI is given. From what I know, a blood transfusion can be performed only if severe anemia is present.
I cannot find any information, nor have I ever read or heard of a blood transfusion and Theraflu combined can give hope to recovery from what's known as "the death sentence" fatal FIP.

I would like all the documented information to read please. Why doesn't Cornell University College of Veterinary Medicine know about this with all the research they've been doing on FIP?

I'm looking forward to reading the information that you will post. Thank you.

 

[CeleryStalker]

@GoldHazel I meant to add this.... remember you asked about sneezing being the cause of her uveitis? I've read up on the topic, and while not extremely common, there is some relation to excessive sneezing and uveitis. My hope has been restored, as least temporarily until this vet calls back and puts the fear back in me again, lol I know I'm no vet, but miracles happen ever day, 80% of all FIP cases are misdiagnosed, and it just never set right with me that she could have this fatal disease when she is SO vibrant and thriving the way she is. If it was FIP, I'd imagine she'd not be thriving, not putting on weight at the rate of about 1/4# a week. I might be fooling myself, but I don't want to let go of the little hope I have that she isn't going to die of this very rare disease.

 

[GoldHazel]

@CeleryStalker have you ever heard of the blood transfusions and Theraflu combined will or can make a FIP cat recover? Because I certainly have not and I think we would have heard about this from fb by now.

Hopefully that vet that can access the online records will be in tomorrow and give you the answer you are needing to hear.

Please be in touch and let us know what's going on with Lady. I am continuing to pray for you both.

 

[GoldHazel]

@GoldHazel I meant to add this.... remember you asked about sneezing being the cause of her uveitis? I've read up on the topic, and while not extremely common, there is some relation to excessive sneezing and uveitis. My hope has been restored, as least temporarily until this vet calls back and puts the fear back in me again, lol I know I'm no vet, but miracles happen ever day, 80% of all FIP cases are misdiagnosed, and it just never set right with me that she could have this fatal disease when she is SO vibrant and thriving the way she is. If it was FIP, I'd imagine she'd not be thriving, not putting on weight at the rate of about 1/4# a week. I might be fooling myself, but I don't want to let go of the little hope I have that she isn't going to die of this very rare disease.

@CeleryStalker, of course severe sneezing can cause blood vessels to break. It can even cause a hernia!
I too would imagine if Lady has FIP, she would not be eating well, gaining weight and active at all. I would imagine she would have a fever, not want to eat, not gain any weight, not wanting to play...just want to lay under a blanket.

 

[Ty Flea]

I think you don't have a enough symptoms for a definite diagnoses and that any vet is going to go with the symptoms they 'like best' and come up with a diagnoses based on that. Different vet, different diagnoses. All based on which symptoms stand out the most to them and what there comfortable with. The PCR should clear up a few things for a better diagnoses. If it was me I'd attack at different angles leaving very little to fall through the cracks. I'd switch her food to a bland high quality dry food. Chicken or beef (fish based diets can be tricky as the amount of potassium and mercury varies wildly and raw diets while amazing have different amounts of minerals and nutrient's at any one given time). For a litter I'd put down those weird looking pellets (no dust and will help with asthma and respiratory issues). I'd also hold her over a vics vaporizer filled with saline at the end of the night and then do coupage (chest taps) to loosen up anything sticking to her respiratory track and make breathing easier. A strong antibiotic like doxycicline at 5 to 8 mg a pound for three weeks should kill off most gram negitive and positive bacteria as well as putting a strong dent in any type of mycoplasmas. (the doxy has some strong side effects but I like to think of it as and antibiotic nuke.. death and destruction to invaders) I'd keep doing the steriodal drops but make sure there a cortisteriod. All together you've treated possible pneumonia, asthma, certain viruses that need high levels of nutrients or protiens, most gram negative and gram positive bacterias, mycoplasma, most types of eye infections, toxoplasmosis, and tick related diseases. It will either help or you'll be able to rule out alot. I'd also check for heartworms. They have the same symptoms.